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Landscape with Falls' colored Trees

Posted: Sun Oct 28, 2018 9:57 pm
by FarbigeWelt
Inspired by falls' colorful brushes.
Falls Trees, CPU Path, 25 S, 2xHD
Falls Trees, CPU Path, 25 S, 2xHD

Closer look at Denoiser, part 1

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:23 am
by FarbigeWelt
Different clamp values lead to different noise pattern. This means the higher the clamp value the larger the range of noise and what is obviously more difficult to be denoised. Resolution 50% HD.
GPU Path_2000S, t depth 16_denoised and raw
GPU Path_2000S, t depth 16_denoised and raw
Clamp is constant at 1000 for the next pictures. Changed values are settings of denoiser: search radius and scales.
GPU Path_500S, t depth 16, cl1.0, sr, sc_denoised and raw
GPU Path_500S, t depth 16, cl1.0, sr, sc_denoised and raw

Re: Different Works in Progress

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:35 am
by Dez!
Very important work.
Saved to my notes

Re: Denoiser

Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 11:44 am
by FarbigeWelt
Dez! wrote:
Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:35 am
Very important work.
Saved to my notes
Thank much you for this feedback.
Further work follows in some days.

Closer look at Denoiser, part 2

Posted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 12:02 am
by FarbigeWelt
LuxCoreRender 2.1 beta 1
Engine GPU Path, Sobol, Adaptive 0.7, 500 Samples
Resolution 1 to 1.5 HD

Details seem not to depend much on search windows radius and scales but smoothness of larger area does.
Denoiser SWRadius, Scales
Denoiser SWRadius, Scales
Histogram threshold simply changes from barely visible effect to smoothed areas.
Its reasonable values seem to be between 0.6 and maybe something above 1.0.
Denoiser Histogram 1
Denoiser Histogram 1
Denoiser Histogram 2
Denoiser Histogram 2
Denoiser Histogram 3
Denoiser Histogram 3

Re: Different Works in Progress

Posted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 11:52 am
by lacilaci
There is no point digging any deeper into this. It works as advertised, I've been looking over the internet and this is simply what it is.
It is not using any extra information that would make it preserve details and no feature recognition so it will never work as any other denoiser in other renderers like vray, corona, cycles, optix etc.
There is no magical settings to make it better, it can be less blury/more noisy or less noisy/more blurry... that's it. And everyone coming from another renderer will be banging their head against the wall questioning what is going on.
You can take your noisy render to lightroom, darktable, gimp whatever and denoise there with just as good result.
This is what proper denoising looks like:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FZXKNBWxQs
and redshift example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ofcCQdIZAd8

Re: Different Works in Progress

Posted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 8:20 pm
by FarbigeWelt
lacilaci wrote:
Thu Nov 01, 2018 11:52 am
There is no point digging any deeper into this. It works as advertised, I've been looking over the internet and this is simply what it is.
It is not using any extra information that would make it preserve details and no feature recognition so it will never work as any other denoiser in other renderers like vray, corona, cycles, optix etc.
There is no magical settings to make it better, it can be less blury/more noisy or less noisy/more blurry... that's it. And everyone coming from another renderer will be banging their head against the wall questioning what is going on.
You can take your noisy render to lightroom, darktable, gimp whatever and denoise there with just as good result.
This is what proper denoising looks like:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FZXKNBWxQs
and redshift example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ofcCQdIZAd8
If I were happy with Lightroom or Photoshop denoiser I would not look closer at LuxCoreRendets denoiser.
I dont‘t agree with your statement noisy or blurry is the only options with LuxCoreRender but it seems quite right for Lightroom or Photoshop.

One big backside at the moment is required time, there I agree with you because for a rather noisy picture you need a search windows radius of 6 or better 8.
There is a long ‚warm up phase‘ let renders hanging at 7 samples for at least 40s for HD resolution.
Some impressions following soon.

By the way, a second camera zooming at texture details helps for lowres previews. I don‘t see any good reason for 4k previews orher than 16 GB VRAM and 200 32bit TFLOPS ;-)

Re: Different Works in Progress

Posted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 8:46 pm
by kintuX
lacilaci wrote:
Thu Nov 01, 2018 11:52 am
There is no point digging any deeper into this. It works as advertised, I've been looking over the internet and this is simply what it is.
It is not using any extra information that would make it preserve details and no feature recognition so it will never work as any other denoiser in other renderers like vray, corona, cycles, optix etc.
There is no magical settings to make it better, it can be less blury/more noisy or less noisy/more blurry... that's it. And everyone coming from another renderer will be banging their head against the wall questioning what is going on.
You can take your noisy render to lightroom, darktable, gimp whatever and denoise there with just as good result.
This is what proper denoising looks like:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FZXKNBWxQs
and redshift example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ofcCQdIZAd8
If so, then simply do it.
Either pay or invest your abilities - skill & talent - into what really matters to you.
Or is that not our civilized consensus, a way of showing what, how much someone values something!?



@FarbigeWelt
Thank you for everything you're posting in this thread. The world is truly colorful :D Keep it up!

PS.
I'm also suspecting sort of pre-processing of textures could be involved to better the BCD results. Every engine is doing/offering some kind of pre-processing on textures before the engine kicks in (appleseed, Cycles, PRMan...). But I don't know about Lux... i need to look further & find the mechanism to test the thesis.

Closer look at Denoiser, part 3

Posted: Thu Nov 01, 2018 10:08 pm
by FarbigeWelt
LuxCoreRender 2.1 beta 1
Blender 2.79b, MS Windows 10 Pro
CPU: 3.5 GHz, i7-4770K, Intel
GPU: 1.0 GHz, 2xHawaii, AMD, 4GB,
RadeonSW Adrenalin 18.9.3
OpenGL/OpenCL 24.20.11000

Render Engine: GPU Sobol, Adaptive Strength 0.95
Total Eye Path 16
Diffuse 2, Glossy 8, Specular 16

Materials: Glossy rough (walls), Mirror, Metal, Glass, Matte black

Scene: VRAM 1080 MB, 7 Lights,
Resolution 1xHD, 1920x1080, 2.14 MPixel
Halt Time 120 s ~500 Samples
Samples/s 400k (denoise warm up) to 8M (render)
Filter none
Reinhard, Pre 1.3, Post 1.3, Burn 6.00
Denoise Test_d 1 to 4
Denoise Test_d 1 to 4
Denoise Test_d 5 to 8
Denoise Test_d 5 to 8
Denoise Test_d 9 to 12
Denoise Test_d 9 to 12
Denoise Test_d 13 to 16
Denoise Test_d 13 to 16
Denoise Test_d 17 to 20
Denoise Test_d 17 to 20
Denoise Test_d 21 to 22
Denoise Test_d 21 to 22
Conclusions:
Improve quality of image for low samples with other parameters, e.g. clamping, before enabling denoiser.
Search Windows Radius (SWR) has the most impact on time, besides resolution of image.
Search Windows Radius of 2 or 3 are okay for previews, for a final render 6 is a got start.
Histogram Distance Threshold (HTD) depends on SWR, if SWR is low and HTD between 0.1 to 1.0 denoiser's result patterns may look uncofortable.
Use of Remove Fireflies is recommended.

Issue:
Scales above 9 leads to Blender crash at the moment denoising starts after render halt.

Re: Different Works in Progress

Posted: Fri Nov 02, 2018 1:43 am
by B.Y.O.B.
FarbigeWelt wrote:
Thu Nov 01, 2018 10:08 pm
Scales above 9 leads to Blender crash at the moment denoising starts after render halt.
Scales above 9 is an insane number.
You should rarely need more than the default of 3.
What this parameter does is it downsizes the image and factors this in during denoising, to remove low-frequency noise (splotches).
So a scale of 3 creates the original res, half res, and 1/4th res.