BlendLuxCore for B2.8 - anytime, biased comparison will be

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lacilaci
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Re: BlendLuxCore for Blender 2.8 - anytime in 2018?

Post by lacilaci » Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:27 am

Sharlybg wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:26 am
with blendluxcore + 2.79b you can do all kind of complex project.
instancing is broken in 2.79 and blendluxcore and it is something B.Y.O.B. said will be looked into in 2.8.

Also complex project is exactly why I hate working with 2.79. (crappy layer systems and groups etc.. all wrong) 2.8 has layer(collection) system that is easy to navigate and work with just like maya or max for example.

And there are many other things in 2.8 that make it attractive. Yes, of course you can work with 2.79 if you really need and want to, you can work with max or maya too if you really want to...

Also, I think it will be much more important to test early 2.8 addon version for bugs than existing 2.79 version

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Re: BlendLuxCore for Blender 2.8 - anytime in 2018?

Post by Dade » Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:23 am

Sharlybg wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:26 am
It is, but no Blender 2.8 support for now(
If i can ask. what do you miss in 2.8 that stop you to use blendluxcore with 2.79b until Devs finish addon for 2.8 ?
Normally with blendluxcore + 2.79b you can do all kind of complex project.
And by using 2.79b and current addon you can also make next 2.8 addon better as you can find bug or way to improve in the next itération.
And it is also easy to have multiple versions of Blender installed like a 2.79b+LuxCore and a v2.80 for when you want to use Eevee, etc.
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Re: BlendLuxCore for Blender 2.8 - anytime in 2018?

Post by Sharlybg » Thu Jan 10, 2019 11:26 am

instancing is broken in 2.79 and blendluxcore and it is something B.Y.O.B. said will be looked into in 2.8.

Also complex project is exactly why I hate working with 2.79. (crappy layer systems and groups etc.. all wrong) 2.8 has layer(collection) system that is easy to navigate and work with just like maya or max for example.

And there are many other things in 2.8 that make it attractive. Yes, of course you can work with 2.79 if you really need and want to, you can work with max or maya too if you really want to...

Also, I think it will be much more important to test early 2.8 addon version for bugs than existing 2.79 version
Yes of courses if we can just have a 2.8 addon right now it would be the best solution for all of us even for BYOB the main addon dev (he have to rewrite and redo the work done in 2018. Even if it is more conversion and adaptation it is not automatic).

That said you can trust BYOB he is really a super guy ( he start coding blendluxcore before the project reboot). So he is the first who it to happen as soon as possible.
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Re: BlendLuxCore for Blender 2.8 - anytime in 2018?

Post by Airstrike » Thu Jan 10, 2019 11:29 am

Sharlybg wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:26 am

If i can ask. what do you miss in 2.8 that stop you to use blendluxcore with 2.79b until Devs finish addon for 2.8 ?
Normally with blendluxcore + 2.79b you can do all kind of complex project.
And by using 2.79b and current addon you can also make next 2.8 addon better as you can find bug or way to improve in the next itération.
Hello there! Oh, where do I start) It was a peculiar evening yesterday.
2.79+LuxCoreRender — my impression:

Ascetic integration — Different nodes, redo assets (re-wire textures)
Stability — Closed without warning or errors (Just after hitting F12)
Features — No Prinicipled shader, no Metalness (eh?), does it mean no PBR? No Glossy/Spec?
Features 2 — No displacement (duh?)
Caustics — 50/50, as it was late, I tried, it crashed

Overall, my revelation was more like this is a square wheel, not a production render.
Why use it over Cycles :?

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Re: BlendLuxCore for Blender 2.8 - anytime in 2018?

Post by Sharlybg » Thu Jan 10, 2019 2:25 pm

Ascetic integration — Different nodes, redo assets (re-wire textures)
Stability — Closed without warning or errors (Just after hitting F12)
Features — No Prinicipled shader, no Metalness (eh?), does it mean no PBR? No Glossy/Spec?
Features 2 — No displacement (duh?)
Caustics — 50/50, as it was late, I tried, it crashed

Overall, my revelation was more like this is a square wheel, not a production render. 
Why use it over Cycles 
F12 crash blender ? You should report bug if it is not done. If already done with the problematic blend file thank you.

Principled shader will come after GI caching in luxcore 2.2. Same for Displacement. Theses features integration can be faster if we had another Core dev ( Dade is alone in this area currently) perhaps you can help to find a Dev to join the project ? Who know a friend with c++ coding ability ?

About shading capability Luxcore is able to simulate almost 99% of physical phenomena. You can download example scene on the download page to test and practice if you want.

For caustics it is clear that Luxcore and cycles are not playing in the same league. Just switch to Bidir engine and metropolis for this kind of work. And if you have problem please post in the forum a lot of people will help you fix issue (faster with blend file).

Why you should you use Luxcore over cycles ? Why you should have to make a choice ? They are both free and opensource you can install luxcore side by side with cycles without problem and then when you will have a better knowlegde of Luxcore mabye comparable to your cycles level it will be easy for you to answer this question:
Why i should use luxcore ?
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Re: BlendLuxCore for Blender 2.8 - anytime in 2018?

Post by Racleborg » Thu Jan 10, 2019 4:09 pm

The Collections in 2.8 is cool, but I'm in no rush for it.

Sharlybg
And by using 2.79b and current addon you can also make next 2.8 addon better as you can find bug or way to improve in the next itération
- Absolutely!

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Re: BlendLuxCore for Blender 2.8 - anytime in 2018?

Post by Airstrike » Thu Jan 10, 2019 11:08 pm

Dear developers and enthusiasts,
I would like to restart discussion, this time with an example.

A chopped scene is rendered*:
* — Light by HDRI, 128 samples by default

EX1. B2.8 + Cycles (CPU+GPU)
280-test1.jpg
EX2. B279 + Lux (bidir is cpu only :? )
279-lux-test1-masked.jpg
The glass looks different, but no to care. The metal part look different without Metallness map, but not to care. Some dispersion (or something) is visible.

And finally this:

EX3. B279 + Lux (bidir cpu only which is pure nonesense)
279-lux-test1-wholeglass.jpg
At last, there is something like caustics!

Bottom line:
For now not sure is it worth it, will try to fake caustics in 2.8 and squeeze Lux for more based on your suggestions.
Questions:
1. Why on Earth bidir is cpu only? Isn't a decent gpu would be faster?
2. How can I make moar caustics, if this is beeing the first point of using Lux? I can't even achieve the level of this example: viewtopic.php?t=448#p4552
3. How can I achieve caustics with my setup — a mix of metal and glass(I provide .blend and .bcf files)?

Blend file, 32 mb https://drive.google.com/file/d/1aPtnPl ... UssGeqXGH/
BCF file, 16 mb https://drive.google.com/file/d/1tUnw_k ... JweAgwYUB1

Thanks!
Last edited by Airstrike on Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:13 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: BlendLuxCore for Blender 2.8 - anytime in 2018?

Post by lacilaci » Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:45 am

Airstrike wrote:
Thu Jan 10, 2019 11:08 pm
How can I make moar caustics, if this is beeing the first point of using Lux?
Before I joined luxcore forums, I have never seen so many people being so much into caustics rendering. With corona the only examples I can remember where people were having hard time without caustics is rendering pools and usually faking it was good enough.
I know corona devs are working on a way to render caustics efficiently. I think I would be more interested into their solution or similar rather than pushing too hard for bidir rendering which seems to be always too slow for most real world production uses.

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Re: BlendLuxCore for B2.8 - anytime, biased comparison will be

Post by B.Y.O.B. » Fri Jan 11, 2019 8:08 am

The images in your post are broken, they don't show up.
Just attach them to your post.
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Re: BlendLuxCore for Blender 2.8 - anytime in 2018?

Post by Dade » Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:23 am

lacilaci wrote:
Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:45 am
I know corona devs are working on a way to render caustics efficiently. I think I would be more interested into their solution or similar rather than pushing too hard for bidir rendering which seems to be always too slow for most real world production uses.
The upcoming GI cache renders caustics for free even with Path tracing. It can render SDS paths too, something even BiDir can not render (it requires vertex merging with BiDirVM).
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